Novice: Kick In and Kick Out question
 

Hello,

I'm trying to learn how to mix the kick drum. I am using BFD2 which has Kick In and Out - which makes sense. I like flexibility. Anyway I also have Waves' SSL which factory presets only has 'Kick Drum' (mean no distinction between In or Out). However the CLA presets has 'Kick 1' and 'Kick 2' -

* Does 1 and 2 refer to In and Out or is that not how it works? They do have slightly different settings that I'm trying understand the subtleties off...

* Also just to confirm: Is Kick Out suppose to better capture details of the 'Slap' sound of the beater and Kick In more of the 'Woof' sound?

Again I'm trying to learn with some preset as a starting point...

Thanks for reading. Nils.

Re: Novice: Kick In and Kick Out question
 

Kick in -> mic inside the kick usually aiming towards where the beater hits, which gives you more of the snap.

Kick out -> mic outside the back of the kick, which gives you more "ooomfh" or "woof".

I also use Waves SSL for drums a lot, but I don't bother with the presets anymore. However, I can't imagine that Kick 1 is meant for the inside mic, and Kick 2 for the outside mic, but of course I could be wrong.

To understand the difference you really need to hear the difference. I'd recommend that start out with the "Kick in" in BFD, and maybe choose one of the presets you mentioned. Tweak to taste, or change preset. Work with that for a while, and then bring in "Kick out" to hear what that has to say for the total sound.

When it comes to eq's and compressors I never use presets, not even the ones I've saved myself. It varies so much from song to song, that I'd rather start from scratch each time. The only time I've actually imported plugin settings from one song into another was when a band had tracked two songs with the same setup in a hurry. I mixed the first, felt good about the mix, so I imported the drum mix (eq's, compressors and reverbs) into the new session.

Re: Novice: Kick In and Kick Out question
 

Thanks a lot PT, this really helps getting the ball rolling.

Nils.

Re: Novice: Kick In and Kick Out question
 

This can be a common problem for any mixer, as in my opinion drums are one of the hardest things to mix. This is why many production houses will fine tune a drum set and leave it indefinitely once a good sound is achieved.

Normally you will have both kick in and kick out mixed together to get the best of both worlds. In digital recording it is my experience that this will prove difficult if the two kick samples aren't in phase cohearance. As you are using a sampler, you may or may not find this a problem, and may or may not be able to fix it unless you print the sounds.

Hoping that the guys who designed your sampler took this into account, make sure that you are compensating for delay from plugs properly if you using any, and that you make sure you don't have an overbearance of any certain frequency typically in the 120-500 ish range causing mud in your mix.

HTH.
D