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-   -   Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series (http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=406627)

sjgam 10-07-2019 12:50 PM

Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Looking at the S4 and S6 closer which seems to be a bit of a blueprint for the streamlined S1 and Dock. Wonder why Avid did not consider the channel strip knob module as an option for the Artist and now S1/Dock series. I think that many knobs to control channel strip plugins and more than 8 parameters at a time would be desirable - speed workflow and lessen menu dives. Kind of like in the MCU Pro world - the C4. Also Softube's Console 1.

And it aligns with Avid's strategy of giving the home project user modules of S6's in bite size chunks that can fit on a home desktop.

Sardi 10-07-2019 01:49 PM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Why? Price.

Every thing has to be made to a price point.

I’d be ecstatic if they just made a controller with knobs and zero faders, but I’m probably in the minority. Essentially, just a Eucon plugin controller.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

BScout 10-07-2019 02:54 PM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sjgam (Post 2540582)
Looking at the S4 and S6 closer which seems to be a bit of a blueprint for the streamlined S1 and Dock. Wonder why Avid did not consider the channel strip module as an option for the Artist and now S1/Dock series. I think that many knobs to control channel strip plugins and more than 8 parameters at a time would be desirable - speed workflow and lessen menu dives. Kind of like in the MCU Pro world - the C4. Also Softube's Console 1.

And it aligns with Avid's strategy of giving the home project user modules of S6's in bite size chunks that can fit on a home desktop.

Because all those modules are useless without the brain which is in the master module and is a full Windows computer. Those modules do nothing without it. There is no embedded logic processor -- it gets all its commands from the master module.

sjgam 10-07-2019 07:03 PM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sardi (Post 2540590)
Why? Price.

Every thing has to be made to a price point.

I’d be ecstatic if they just made a controller with knobs and zero faders, but I’m probably in the minority. Essentially, just a Eucon plugin controller.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Price - this would be a module- so you don’t have to buy it with mix or dock. Doesn’t have motorized faders but more knobs so maybe same price as mix. Speculation of course.

Yeah I was thinking of it as a plug-in controller with lots of knobs.

sjgam 10-07-2019 07:08 PM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BScout (Post 2540605)
Because all those modules are useless without the brain which is in the master module and is a full Windows computer. Those modules do nothing without it. There is no embedded logic processor -- it gets all its commands from the master module.

Obviously in the same vein as the S1/mix and dock which draw inspiration from the S6 - the “artist” channel module would communicate though eucon/Ethernet and daw.

BScout 10-07-2019 11:46 PM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sjgam (Post 2540629)
Obviously in the same vein as the S1/mix and dock which draw inspiration from the S6 - the “artist” channel module would communicate though eucon/Ethernet and daw.

You do know the fader module (what you are calling the channel module) is US$5,500? And it has no "brain" which you'd now like implemented in the module.
The cost of all of this would eliminate any buyers/users. If Avid could do this for $1-$1.5k they would have done it already.

And the current S6 fader modules (actually all modules) do communicate via eucon/Ethernet -- they just need to communicate to the master module (which then communicates to the host Pro Tools computer.) It's all an ethernet/Eucon web of communication.

sjgam 10-08-2019 07:46 AM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BScout (Post 2540646)
You do know the fader module (what you are calling the channel module) is US$5,500? And it has no "brain" which you'd now like implemented in the module.
The cost of all of this would eliminate any buyers/users. If Avid could do this for $1-$1.5k they would have done it already.

And the current S6 fader modules (actually all modules) do communicate via eucon/Ethernet -- they just need to communicate to the master module (which then communicates to the host Pro Tools computer.) It's all an ethernet/Eucon web of communication.

Hey I think you are missing my point/suggestion and getting boggled down with the cost and complexity of the S6. The given is that the S6 and modules are relatively expensive compared to artist/S1/Dock. Part of the idea of the Artist/S1/Dock is to get you features/workflow of the S6 at lower price. They have done that with mixer/fader with Mix/S1 and transport/center console features with Dock. My suggestion is that they could come up with "Artist" version of knob module. One argument that there is appetite in consumer market is the Softtube Console 1 with all its channel strips knobs and Mackie C4 which I see still for sale on used market.

Note - correction I meant to say Channel Strip Knob module in first post - and just said Channel Strip module.

BScout 10-08-2019 11:38 AM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
The "knob" module is the Dock.
There are 8 of them. Plus it acts like a mini MTM unit.

If you've never gathered why the C4 was discontinued it was because there was no demand. I know the ins-outs of the C4 situation because back in 2004/2005, Mackie tried to get me to consult on it.

The Dock can supply the Console 1 functions. The Console 1 supplies info on one channel and since it has no touchscreen has to divide by process type. The Dock has the dynamic nature of the touchscreen so it can update to what process type needs to be controlled and reuse the 8 knobs (and multiple pages of control.)

What you aren't getting is cost of manufacturing and demand. High cost of manufacturing, low demand. They already have the Dock. Have you used one? Have you used the S6 Knob module? The Dock (and now the S1) is clever in that it splits the cost so it seems less expensive by making the touchscreen a separate 3rd party purchase. The S6 Knob module has a little screen per every knob. 32 little screens and 32 touch-sensitive knobs with colour feedback. In manufacturing, the single strip screen on the Artist Mix is way cheaper than doing multiple little screens. And the failure rate will go up too with more parts.

What would be your layout for an "Artist Knob module" and at what cost do you think it should sell for? If you take a moment from just coveting the S6 knob module, you'll see it's not feasible or demanded. They streamlined the Artist/MC series for a reason -- a lot of the products had very low demand and keeping a manufacturing line increases cost for low quantity production. An Artist Knob module would be one more product to put Avid closer to bankruptcy.
If you don't use a Dock daily, I suggest getting deeply involved in it.

sjgam 10-08-2019 12:34 PM

Re: Idea - Channel Module with Artist/S1 Series
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BScout (Post 2540702)
The "knob" module is the Dock.
There are 8 of them. Plus it acts like a mini MTM unit.

If you've never gathered why the C4 was discontinued it was because there was no demand. I know the ins-outs of the C4 situation because back in 2004/2005, Mackie tried to get me to consult on it.

The Dock can supply the Console 1 functions. The Console 1 supplies info on one channel and since it has no touchscreen has to divide by process type. The Dock has the dynamic nature of the touchscreen so it can update to what process type needs to be controlled and reuse the 8 knobs (and multiple pages of control.)

What you aren't getting is cost of manufacturing and demand. High cost of manufacturing, low demand. They already have the Dock. Have you used one? Have you used the S6 Knob module? The Dock (and now the S1) is clever in that it splits the cost so it seems less expensive by making the touchscreen a separate 3rd party purchase. The S6 Knob module has a little screen per every knob. 32 little screens and 32 touch-sensitive knobs with colour feedback. In manufacturing, the single strip screen on the Artist Mix is way cheaper than doing multiple little screens. And the failure rate will go up too with more parts.

What would be your layout for an "Artist Knob module" and at what cost do you think it should sell for? If you take a moment from just coveting the S6 knob module, you'll see it's not feasible or demanded. They streamlined the Artist/MC series for a reason -- a lot of the products had very low demand and keeping a manufacturing line increases cost for low quantity production. An Artist Knob module would be one more product to put Avid closer to bankruptcy.
If you don't use a Dock daily, I suggest getting deeply involved in it.

I have and use the Dock and the Mix and Console 1. Of course there is always concerns about production costs and demand. Thats a given. I don't have access to usage or survey numbers on current or potential product lines. Your experience with C4 suggests maybe no appetite for lots of knobs module.

Again the general idea apparently has been with Artist Level, is to draw inspiration from the S6 - motorized faders seem good (Mix/S1), screen with knobs and transport controls and soft keys seem good (Dock) - lots of knobs with knob module for immediate access without paging/menu diving to more than 8 knobs for plugin parameters seems appealing too. Apparently S6 users like them.

On a constructive note - off of your question - I would think it would sit beside the Artist Mix/S1. Perhaps for some if budget was an issue - they might go for 8 faders and 32 knobs beside each other and some would prefer two Mix's/S1's. Again speculating but cost would be in the range of a dock or mix or S1 - no motorized faders but more knobs/displays etc.

But of course to state the obvious and is true of any idea - if numbers don't support business case then no-one will pursue - but then again this is a user forum where people exchange ideas without having access to survey/usage numbers.

And there is low hanging fruit to pull from the competition and the S6 to speculate about.


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