S3 vs Two S1's
Curious why new buyer would opt for S3 over two S1's - my pass at pro's and con's:
Display - S1's have tablet meters and other display functions while S3 has led meters in surface of controller Modular/Expandable - S1's with magnets are modular and can go larger than 16 tracks Price - 2 S1's are cheaper but iPad Pro choice gets it closer to total price, no tablet or small tablet - much cheaper Number of Encoders - S3 has 32 encoders with two independent rows and two S1's only 16 Buttons - S3 has more customizable buttons Pre's - S3 has two mic pre's Size - two S1's are 4 inches narrower than S3 Quality - both seem the same and have current modern design in line with Dock. |
Re: S3 vs Two S1's
Well I will add that the S3 has a more expensive feel. Quite a lot better feel and with a Dock and iPad it is a Super killer setup. The S1 will replace the aartist series which was the budget line of Avids controllers and the S3 is still a much Higher end unit so thats not a good comparison! ... sorry! The S1 will be around 1000-1200 USD and the S3 is 4-5 times that price for a reason.
The S3 has built-in 4-input, 6-output AVB Core Audio interface to connect your studio, Record vocals and instrument performances through two high-quality XLR mic/line inputs and two TRS line inputs. And connect studio speakers, headphones, and other gear to four line outputs and one stereo headphone output Now the S1 will be the budget line of the Avid line of controllers and the S3 is still a much more high end unit. |
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All of the above, and:
Pros: -S3 has meters on every fader. -With Dock, you don't need screens over the faders, so S3 looks better and fits in front of the computer monitor better. -not sure yet how S1's will support S3's very useful Multimaster Mode with VCAs. Cons: -S1's modifier keys on the bottom are easier to use and more like the S6. -Sel/Rec switches are located in a better place on S1. I have no regrets having purchased S3. I wouldn't trade it for a discount and two S1s. |
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As Avid implied, the S1 will replace the S3... This unit fade away... It will be supported, but you cannot buy it anymore...
So why? The S1 has the same hardware components as the S3. It has one oled row; the s3 has two, but this is no problem... The S1 has no audio interface, but the interface of the s3 is obsolete for people using HDX and HD Interfaces. The s3 has cheap metering next to the faders, but with the S1, you don´t need it. With using the s1 with Ipads or Android tablets, you get the S6 Metering. No need for a second row of Oleds, cause with the Displays, you get everything you need. The S3 is not better in quality... S1 uses alp Faders and the same knobs as the S3... AND THE MOST IMPORTANT thing is, you can use up to 32 Faders with the modular S1. This will never happen to the S3, cause Eddie Jones said, that there are so massiv problems to integrate the 2 S3s.... It will never happen... S3 is EOL... The S1 will be the replacement... I love my S3, but i will sell it, cause this unit has no future anymore... And if i think to have 4 S1s, with 4 Ipad Pros... Wow great setup... Great Metering and perfect visual feedback... Eddie said, that the s3 will be support till 2022, i think...but when the s1 is released, the s3 will vanish from the market... |
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Eddie from Avid on this forum explicitly stated that the S3 is not EOL. Of course market demand in the future will force these decisions on any of the products including S3. Interesting how you and other actual S3 owners have different takes on to keep or move to S1. |
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The higher price is also influenced by S3 having double the faders, double the encoders and oled displays, more programmable buttons and the two pres with avb interface and of course whatever they think the market can bear. I am personally drawn to the s3 (dock and mix owner) as for home project user 16 is the max faders I need and the S1 tablets will interfere with monitor display view and I can get the meter display with the dock and I personally like the meters on the controller. And I really like the two rows of encoders to have immediate access to two plugins or plugins and sends at same time. Also maybe the S1 release may drop the used prices on s3’s. |
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I am looking into switching over to S1 for a small mixing suite as, by the looks of it, can offer more for my workflow (thanks to the ipad), at a cheaper price and with the exact same components of the S3. I also know of other studios who currently have d-commands and havenot switched to S6 or S4 because of the increased price and instead are looking at the S1 as replacements. Not the S3. The fact that the S3 is 5k and the S1 is 1K is irrelevant to its actual quality and use case, and given that the components are equal, the S1 makes sense as a substitute for the S3 in a lot of cases. |
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I think with S1's introduction with same quality components, one has to think of good use cases for deploying the two sets of encoders. As for the tablet meters feature, none of us have working experience with S1 to conclude the meters and other interactive display features have enough value to deal with accommodating the extra vertical space of tablets sticking out above your controller possibly in front of part of your monitor or just have strong preference for the meters embedded on the S3. I think most buying a 5 k controller already have invested in an audio interface. In a live situation the pre's/AVB interface make a lot more sense with S3L. Have to come to terms with maxing out at 16 faders and on flip side, in a tight/mobile situation have the smaller format S1 to literally physically fit were the S3 might not fit.
That extra row of encoders is attractive to me as I am all about less menu diving while editing parameters. But I don't see a lot of chatter on this forum about exploiting them. |
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Just adding a data point: you can get an S3 new for about $3900.
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(BTW I have not personally seen a new S3 going for $3900) |
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First of all i love my s3 and dock combo... It works...
The biggest con is the limitation to 16 faders +1 of the dock. The next thing is the position of some buttons, which works for live, but not really for other applications. Remember the S3 was released as live control surface and not for Protools at all. The artist transport was a very good addition to the s3. It had a Numpad, but thats all history, cause it was replaced by the dock, which is a great piece of hardware in combination with the Ipad. I quote Ediie Jones about the S3 "At present we have no plans to EOL S3 but if sales drop to nothing next year we might be forced to. Dont forget even if we do there will be a further 5 years hardware support and we still release free updates today for the very first Artist Mix 12 years ago, so software wont be an issue." If i would decide today, i won´t buy a S3, cause the S1 has the same hardware and with the Ipads a better Meter Bridge (S6 like). Would i miss the second row of Oleds... No, cause the visual feedback of the Ipads is better. Pan, Sends and so on... Would i miss the meters next to the fader... Yes... cause they are a good indication, but i think the S6 Meters with S1 are better... Lets speak of the price point... Lets buy 2 S1s (1299) and 2 Ipad Pro 12 and a high qualitiy audio interface... You are in the same price region as the s3 or above.... The s3 is still a great compact control surface with integratet AVB Audio interface. Its handy, if you take it on stage or need to travel for recordings. But lets face it... It will never get the possibility to add Ipads or another Tablet to get the S6 style metering. And you will always be limited to 16 Faders.... My future setup for my home studio will be... 4 S1 (32 Faders) 4 Ipad Pros 12 for metering... thats it, cause as a hdx user i dont need an audio interface, cause i have my HD Interfaces...Omni and more... So yes i think with the new modular approach of the s1, it will replace the s3... |
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FWIW, I found several android tablets on Amazon with 11.5-12.5" screens and priced under $200;)
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So at this point the opinions are 50/50 (if I can count correctly) |
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The best thing,Avid could do, is to release a S2...
A 8 Fader Control Surface with all S1 features and the S3 features combined. I mean 2 rows of oled displays and encoders and the meter next to the fader. So you have an 8 Fader S3 with S6 metering through Ipads or Android tablets. This would be so great... 4 S2s means 32 Faders... I think, an audio interface is not needed, cause everyone has external hardware from Avid,UAD or Antelope or Apogee... Is there anyone out there, who is using the AVB interface of the S3 as main Audio Hardware? |
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I think for myself, I'm probably going to get a 3 s1's with android tablets, and the dock with the ipad pro 12.9 I already have. Then I'll get a raven so I can use it to quick input plugins sends and I/O and do editing on the edit window. If both system can work together, that would be a really good combo and that would be really close to the system I pitched Avid earlier this year. Well I just found some people are actually using the Raven MTI2 with Artist mix, so the s1 and MTI2 should work, yay! |
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what's old is new again want proper faders a used d command is the way to go if it fits your work flow pro feel all the way i brought a used one never looked back!
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Maybe there's more on amazon.com than .ca which is the one for canadians. but then again might not be able to get it shipped here. |
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ALL it would take to keep the S3 viable in the new line up of products would be to make it LINKABLE/MODULAR, like the D Command, Artist Series, S1 or S6! If they lifted that totally imposed 16 fader limit, they'd have sold thousands of more units just to the people who wanted more faders to begin with.
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Here's a pic with $220 Samsung Galaxy Tab A 10.5.
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How well will the S1's work with Cubase/Nuendo? Do we still have the same limitations from the Artist Series (Hardware won't follow on screen vies of the DAW, Tracks page on PT Control - Now Avid Control- will cause Nuendo to crash, etc.)? Also, is there any chance you'll offer an S1 level Joystick Module? :confused:
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The other day I was working in a studio with S6, and the furniture was way too deep, so you could barely reach the knobs on the MTM while seated. I was quite literally wishing I was in my studio where the Dock knobs are in reach. Keep in mind that this is the fault of the furniture, not the S6! |
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If you have two S1 units, will they bank 16 faders at a time or 8 like on the Artist mix?
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"If multiple S1s (or Artist Mix) are present, banking any unit banks all units." So apparently both Mix and S1 units should all bank. http://resources.avid.com/SupportFil...ces_v19.12.pdf |
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Nudge by 1, Bank by 8 for both S1 and Mix
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