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-   -   11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem (http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=357706)

rainsong 08-19-2014 01:21 PM

11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
When using Maschine, Kontakt or Massive (or probably others, I'm guessing) on an Instrument track, Delay Compensation does not happen properly. If I use it on an Audio or Aux track it seems okay.

This is confirmed by looking at the Mixer with Delay Compensation view on. The same plug in will have "0" in the delay column if it's on an Instrument track while it will have "1693" (or whatever the appropriate delay is) if it's on an Audio or Aux track. It becomes worse (further out of sync) when an audio track is in record.

If I copy the same plug from an Instrument track to an Audio or Aux track and solo both, they will flam.

Oddly, it doesn't happen with the Click II plugin...Delay Compensation seems to be fine with that plugin regardless of it being on an Instrument/Aux/audio track.

I'm on 11.2.1, OSX 10.9.3. Happens regardless of Playback Buffer settings.

Have also experienced latency weirdness on record that is solved by reloading the session.

Intransit 08-19-2014 02:05 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
I'm having hard time following this.

But Dly Comp seems okay over here with Instrument tracks. I even have a test session with Kontakt, Battery, massive and audio tracks playing together in sync. Auto report and user field option.

damasio 08-19-2014 02:10 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
So this announcement can be discarded?
http://www.pro-tools-expert.com/home...ugs-fixed.html

damasio 08-19-2014 02:11 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Intransit (Post 2179708)
I'm having hard time following this.

But Dly Comp seems okay over here with Instrument tracks. I even have a test session with Kontakt, Battery, massive and audio tracks playing together in sync. Auto report and user field option.

Don't forget to use to route the instruments to multiple outputs in protools. That is where the trouble starts.

Intransit 08-19-2014 02:17 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by damasio (Post 2179712)
Don't forget to use to route the instruments to multiple outputs in protools. That is where the trouble starts.

Yes. I was one of the first to find the bug along with others and have been going back and forth with AVID. I have sessions with 7 kontakts all routed to instrument tracks and a test session I've been using for months. It all seems to working over here.

I have cues with 200+ instrument tracks that are playing fine. I even printed and played against printed tracks that were using the bypass auto report workaround.

I'm not saying it's not happening but I guess I'm concerned. But all seems okay over here. Others have reported it fixed with instrument tracks. Also a tech at Avid told me the only difference between Instrument and aux tracks is the midi.

Intransit 08-19-2014 02:31 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Just to show I'm not being combative or making this up. This is my test session:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/oyoblhiilc...ADC_11_2_1.png

It all plays sync'd. Auto report and the user field workaround sound the same now. With ADC off this sounds ridiculous.

Any chance there's something your doing that's causing this? I'm curious.

rainsong 08-19-2014 02:53 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Well...as I've been messing with this, I've found that if I control-command click the delay setting to bypass it on the Instrument track, it will play in sync with the same plugin on an Aux track. If not, it's a flam-fest.

Curious if I'm the only one experiencing this, and if so...why.

Screenshot with Delay Compensation on as normal: (flam fest)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/l6wqmb6qs6...s%20normal.png

Screenshot with reported delay turned off on the instrument track: (syncs perfectly)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/36yshk07rx...st%20track.png

And just to prove I'm on PT 11.2.1: :)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/siw92plniq...T%2011.2.1.png

Intransit 08-19-2014 04:27 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Maybe it's machine?? I did the same thing with Kontakt here. Copied it and triggered with a midi track. It still sync'd adding a Kontakt on an aux.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/eze14wezsx...11_2_1%202.png

Intransit 08-19-2014 04:32 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
I looks like it's not pushing the machine Inst track forward. Put a latency inducing plug on the Inst track… What happens?

I'm not an expert on why some tracks have a comp number and some don't. My test session has tracks without a comp number but it still sounds sync'd

mykhal c 08-19-2014 07:59 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rainsong (Post 2179699)
When using Maschine, Kontakt or Massive (or probably others, I'm guessing) on an Instrument track, Delay Compensation does not happen properly. If I use it on an Audio or Aux track it seems okay.

This is confirmed by looking at the Mixer with Delay Compensation view on. The same plug in will have "0" in the delay column if it's on an Instrument track while it will have "1693" (or whatever the appropriate delay is) if it's on an Audio or Aux track. It becomes worse (further out of sync) when an audio track is in record.

If I copy the same plug from an Instrument track to an Audio or Aux track and solo both, they will flam.

Oddly, it doesn't happen with the Click II plugin...Delay Compensation seems to be fine with that plugin regardless of it being on an Instrument/Aux/audio track.

I'm on 11.2.1, OSX 10.9.3. Happens regardless of Playback Buffer settings.

Have also experienced latency weirdness on record that is solved by reloading the session.

FWIW...it's only the display reporting that's off...at least that's what i'm seein' in my testing. everything plays in sync when i test K5 or any other VI (so far). but if you look at the track where the VI is inserted and you start inserting plugins on other trax then you will see that the ADC reporting is properly reported on all trax except where a VI is inserted. even the multi-outs of that VI have proper reporting. and to take it one step further it 'appears' to be on only trax/sessions created in 11.2.1. if i open a session created from an earlier version the reporting seems accurate. but i'm not seein'/hearin' any outta sync issues with this version to date...

rainsong 08-19-2014 09:32 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Intransit (Post 2179744)
I looks like it's not pushing the machine Inst track forward. Put a latency inducing plug on the Inst track… What happens?

I'm not an expert on why some tracks have a comp number and some don't. My test session has tracks without a comp number but it still sounds sync'd

I've been too busy with work to comprehensively test this further today…but it is definitely audibly out of sync (Maschine plays early) if I don't disable delay reporting on an Inst version of Maschine. Been working with it all day on an Aux track with no problems though.

When I get a chance, I'll try and suss this out further.

rainsong 08-19-2014 09:39 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mykhal c (Post 2179776)
FWIW...it's only the display reporting that's off...at least that's what i'm seein' in my testing. everything plays in sync when i test K5 or any other VI (so far).

<snip>
Quote:

Originally Posted by mykhal c (Post 2179776)
but i'm not seein'/hearin' any outta sync issues with this version to date...

Unfortunately this isn't the case for me. It's pretty obviously playing out of sync when using Maschine on an Instrument track. Turns into an absolute train wreck if I've got an audio track on record input.

I'm starting to think this may be an issue that's only happening with Maschine and not any other plugins (even the ones not visually reporting delay comp). That's the only thing that would explain the fact that no one else here is experiencing what I am.

mykhal c 08-19-2014 09:52 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rainsong (Post 2179796)
<snip>


Unfortunately this isn't the case for me. It's pretty obviously playing out of sync when using Maschine on an Instrument track. Turns into an absolute train wreck if I've got an audio track on record input.

I'm starting to think this may be an issue that's only happening with Maschine and not any other plugins (even the ones not visually reporting delay comp). That's the only thing that would explain the fact that no one else here is experiencing what I am.

understood...hope you can drill down on the cause...

damasio 08-20-2014 12:43 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
I;m installing a new harddrive for 11.2.1 to run some tests. I don't want to mess with my current setup because i'm in the middle of a project.
But i do use maschine and Geist so i'll test it.

rainsong 08-20-2014 03:43 PM

Re: 11.2.1: Instrument Track delay compensation problem
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by damasio (Post 2179946)
I;m installing a new harddrive for 11.2.1 to run some tests. I don't want to mess with my current setup because i'm in the middle of a project.
But i do use maschine and Geist so i'll test it.

I'd love to know if you experience the same issue.


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